18 November 2009
Group Five: Learning-I love to tell the story
There was certainly a lot of variety in these clips, and we agreed that most of them were geared toward adults, with Veggie Tales being the obvious exclusion, and the Simpsons sitting on the border of child/adult. It also seems that sometimes judging between explicit/implicit/null is not totally concrete and can vary depending on one’s perspective, to a certain extent. Now I’ll focus on each clip.
Clip One: We felt this clip had explicit learning in the point the scholars make that historical fact does not agree with what the Bible says. Implicit learning is similar but starker, asserting that the Bible is wrong, inaccurate, or unreliable. Null learning would be in the way they are using such specific details to ‘prove’ the Bible inaccurate, claiming, even though it isn’t mentioned, that the Bible is meant to function at least partly as a historical treatise. This relates to the stage of learning associated with high school age where one struggles with testing one’s faith out in the world without that foundational support and struggling with what is literal, what is symbolic, and what matters most.
Clip Two: Explicit lessons would be moral ones, related to not taking things from others, especially when you have plenty. Another explicit message is that the Bible’s messages are good and true. An implicit message would be not to judge others before you look at yourself, and also could be of guilt. Or maybe one or both of those is null, sorry I am not sure it’s totally clear there. This clip was easiest, it seemed, to classify with a stage, because it is obviously geared toward children. The use of simplified language and humor, the slower pace of the whole thing, caters perfectly to the developmental levels of young children.
Clip Three: An explicit lesson is for people to stand up for what they believe in, even if they are the only one. An implicit lesson is leaving the church rather than fixing it. A null lesson is that everyone can be bought, even pastors. In terms of stages this clip has a sense of justice, from the 7-8 year old range, and from the 11-12 year old range we see Lisa trying to define herself over and against authority and convention.
Clip Four: Explicit learning is in the idea that it is okay and acceptable to sing religious songs in a secular environment. Implicit learning is in the appearance that worship songs must be sung by a group, and should include robed gospel choirs. Null learning might be that even singing worship songs in a secular setting is ok if it is done by the ‘right’ people or ‘cool’ people. The learning stage this most reflects is the junior high stage, where life is about cliques and being in with the right people and making fun of the ‘wrong’ crowd.
Clip Five: This one I think had the most disagreement. One person saw explicit learning as Christians have to watch what they say. Another saw explicit denouncement of ‘right-wing’ evangelical Christianity. One person saw implicit learning as Christians are full of hate and judgmental and that we can pick and choose scripture to fit our own agenda. Another saw ‘all Christians are like James Dobson’ as implicit. Another saw implicit support for a more ‘reasoned’ for of Christianity (or at least not outright denouncement of it). Null learning was related to lack of endorsement for Christianity by one, and that Christians don’t really know what they’re talking about so do what you want by another. The stage of development associated with this one is high school/young adult because there is a challenge to beliefs and opinions that are often formed in those years.
Clip Six: Explicit learning is present when the man tells River that the Bible is about faith and believing in God. Implicit learning is that the Bible doesn’t always make rational sense, and holding onto the pages marks that struggle. Null learning here is when someone doesn’t understand the Bible or is struggling with faith one should take it from them and show them how they are wrong. This clip also represents the high school stage, as River is about that age and she is struggling with concrete vs. symbolic and how to fit faith and reason together.
Clip Seven: Explicit learning is about faith trusting God’s promise. Implicit learning is that faith often means persecution and difficulty, and Christians in other countries have more experience with that. A null lesson could be that someone such as the President can have a say on one’s faithfulness and depth of Christian nature. The stage here begins in the teen years but really extends through the rest of our life. It involves “the growth of our personal consciousness out of both the memorization of fact into true belief, and the growth of our self absorption into communion with our peers.”
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19 November 2009 at 7:39 pm
Frieda says...
Clip 2 being a cartoon with vegetable characters seems clearly geared to children though adults would approve the moral lesson. I thought null learning was what wasn’t said but perhaps should be so in clip 6 I thought the man was shown telling the girl to stop tearing up her Bible to make it more sensible. Your groups comments were well thought out.
19 November 2009 at 11:01 pm
Great job in analyzing each of these clips using the explicit, implicit and null learnings. I think the conversations your group had on the Jon Stewart clip is interesting. I am thinking from the explicit learning perspective that Jon Stewart is the teacher and the audience is the learner, and that Stewart is being extremely intentional in his approach to leave the impression that Christians – aka – “Republicans” – will use the Bible to fit their needs and advance their cause. The lesson here is – the cause comes first (e.g. – doctrine) and then you select those pieces of Scripture to be interpreted to fit the cause – even if it is the same Scripture twisted to mean something new. Your thoughts?
19 November 2009 at 11:55 pm
Since I was looking at the Bible aspects I didn’t really get a chance to examine so closely the way that these have distinct lessons. I wonder if you feel that there should be more media aimed towards children in our attempt at telling the story to them. Veggie Tales are great and they really do help adults explain to children through a fun medium the lessons of these biblical stories. Do you think that if there was more things like Veggie Tales that children would understand it or get bored with it after a while? I think there are many different ways to portray a story and still have the same outcome come out that is found in the bible. I am curious to see if you think that we don’t do that because we deem religious education as a teenager thing. With that said, what do you feel about the lack of media aimed toward teenagers and young adults? That period of time can be highly trying for a person religiously.
Just a few questions I had. You guys did great! Happy Thanksgiving to you all!
20 November 2009 at 12:00 pm
I found your responses and discussion to Clip 5 very interesting. The wide range of respones is reflective of the different contexts we find eachother in. Without looking further into the developmental stages at this point, I wonder if this is not just a high school/young adult area of development, but a lifelong development area. We are constantly changing and evolving our ideas when it comes to what is an acceptable way of looking at Christianity and politics. The discussion you had as a group was a perfect example of the very different and very positive dialogue we have with eachother even as adults.
20 November 2009 at 5:16 pm
group4 says...
I was intrigued by your statement that the American Idol clip explicitly shows us that it is ok to have religious songs in secular settings. I realize your group wasn’t making a value judgement about whether or not that’s true. Still, I wonder what our culture does teach about having religious things in secular settings & what people think about this. In one of the postings for another group, someone also talked about how the song can be useful and good as a ritual that might move people even if they were not already Christian.
I am wondering what other people think about this concept. I think it was in the Palmer book that he talked about the fact that he could not support public prayer in school (am I right?) on the grounds that she didn’t want her religious beliefs forced on others (someone clarify for me if you remember more clearly). I can see how there could be value in doing a ritual even if you don’t have the faith yet, i.e. go to church and somewhere along the lines you might find that you believe. That makes sense, but that is a choice. As I watched the clip, I found myself wondering whether all of the singers were Christians, and what that would be like to sing the song if you weren’t just not Christian, but if you were actually committed to a different religion, which given the religious diversity of our country, was most likely the case.
In one sense, having a song like this on a very popular, secular tv show gains exposure and could be powerful for some. It’s an opportunity to teach via popular culture, which seems like a good plan. On the other hand, I wonder whether we would feel the same way if it were Muslim song, for instance.
20 November 2009 at 5:17 pm
group4 says...
the above from Julie Bender, Group 4
20 November 2009 at 6:14 pm
Palmer does not support prayer in secular/public education because of it needing to be too vague in order to fit everyone’s beliefs…at least that is what I got. The awesomeness of clip 4 for me is that it was not vague at all. They even said the name of Jesus and called him their comfort and strength and nothing compares to the promise we have in him. I think of the lyrics of the song as being explicit learning. Obviously, i would not have found it to be awesome if they were singing a song that disagreed with my own personal beliefs. =) Since I believe that we are called to spread the Gospel message, I thought it was an amazing way to do so, in a format that is watched by millions of people, who also look up to the individuals who were singing. I am always surprised at how many of the American Idols mention their faith and their church on the show. Many of them have been worship leaders and/or have gone on to produce Christian music albums.
20 November 2009 at 10:18 pm
While reading this post I thought about how our ministries, Bible studies, messages, conversations, events, comments, even our lives have explicit, implicit, and null messages. These messages can vary based on the perspectives, circumstances, and experiences of different audiences. I think the distinction and understanding of concrete vs abstract begins in late elementary/early middle school, but probably continues throughout life even after one grasps the concept.